Todd Cordell: More thoughts on Nico Hischier and Nolan Patrick

I was originally team Patrick but now am leaning Nico. Also, it doesn't matter what I think.

"I'm not trying to knock Ekblad as, again, he is a solid player. I'm making the point that just because a player has been ranked No. 1 in his draft class for more than a year doesn't mean he will be the best player. Nail Yakupov is another example of that."

Yakupov isnt good?

I too was originally all over taking Patrick. But reconsidering the injury factor - is the tie-breaker for me. I think Nico is the choice now.

If I was redrafting 2014, I still take Ekblad first, although if I had been drafting that year, I'd have taken Draisaitl second (he was already a complete player at the time of the draft with few weaknesses to his game: I have no idea why Calgary and Buffalo wanted their guys).

Ekblad had a bad year, but he's been having injury problems (concussion) and it's hurt his career trajectory. To me, he's still a #1 d-man and he will be for years to come. That year, he was a man among boys and he was pretty much a #1 dman as soon as he came into the league.

At worst, he'd be #2 to Draisaitl if most GMs were drafting today, not a knock to Nylander and Ehlers who are both looking to be studs... Ekblad's just been "invisible" because he's on an invisible team. The same thing happens to our players.

I think Ekblad still holds up as the best player in that draft. I'm fairly confident all of those teams would trade their guy (Draisaitl, Nylander, Ehlers) straight up for Ekblad, if injury concerns were put aside. You could make a strong case for Draisaitl being better but I think Edmonton would still make that deal.

I've started warming up to Hischier, but I'm still worried about such a high rise in draft stock. Aren't those the biggest bust risks?

Completely agree on Nico being the better choice.

The Ekblad comparison lost me though. He is a superior player to all you mentioned, just dealing with concussion issues the past year. You could make a case for Draisaitl being right there with him but struggled his first year and a part while Ekblad was Florida's best player as an 18 year old.

I've started warming up to Hischier, but I'm still worried about such a high rise in draft stock. Aren't those the biggest bust risks?
- willschulme

That's what worries me yes he is a good player but was this season a fluke? Idk if I take that risk if I'm Shero plus the Devils need to add some size a Patrick is the bigger of the two

Teams draft depending on organizational needs. And during the 14 draft the Panthers didn't need a center or winger with Barkov, Bjukstad, Huberdeau and Trochek as their young core.

That's what worries me yes he is a good player but was this season a fluke? Idk if I take that risk if I'm Shero plus the Devils need to add some size a Patrick is the bigger of the two
- Devils314

It's funny bc this exact debate will be going on every day for the next month. Nobody knows who they will pick. We should be happy with either considering it was handed to us by some lottery balls for nothing.

That's what worries me yes he is a good player but was this season a fluke? Idk if I take that risk if I'm Shero plus the Devils need to add some size a Patrick is the bigger of the two

If Hischier had that season and never produced at that rate before, I'd agree; however, that isn't the case. The reason this is his 'only good season' is that it is his first in NA. Nico did put up strong numbers overseas so it isn't an outlier. He just now has shown it translates to NA ice.

And if we want size, I would love to Shero to dip back into the first round and grab Hague! Now that guy is huge!

1) Patrick was a big part of that dominant Wheaties team, not a mere passenger.

2) In terms of pedigree, as a 16-year-old, he was already a 30-goal, point-per-game player in the Western League.

3) Even with the injury issues this past season and the Wheaties being not nearly as strong, he still averaged roughly 1.4 points per game. The previous year, healthier and with a loaded lineup, he was 1.42 PPG. Hardly a big drop.

4) I have no idea where this "lazy player" and "bad teammate" nonsense is coming from in some of the pubs. If the former is because of the sports hernia injury and recovery time frame, well, he wouldn't be the first player to have physical struggle mistaken by some for apathy. As for "bad teammate", he's worn the C with Brandon and was also a captain at lower levels.

4) I have no idea where this "lazy player" and "bad teammate" nonsense is coming from in some of the pubs. If the former is because of the sports hernia injury and recovery time frame, well, he wouldn't be the first player to have physical struggle mistaken by some for apathy. As for "bad teammate", he's worn the C with Brandon and was also a captain at lower levels.
- bmeltzer

It was from a McCagg article. He runs recrutes.ca and got a lot of quotes from coaches/scouts in that article saying things along those lines.

1) Patrick was a big part of that dominant Wheaties team, not a mere passenger.

2) In terms of pedigree, as a 16-year-old, he was already a 30-goal, point-per-game player in the Western League.

3) Even with the injury issues this past season and the Wheaties being not nearly as strong, he still averaged roughly 1.4 points per game. The previous year, healthier and with a loaded lineup, he was 1.42 PPG. Hardly a big drop.

4) I have no idea where this "lazy player" and "bad teammate" nonsense is coming from in some of the pubs. If the former is because of the sports hernia injury and recovery time frame, well, he wouldn't be the first player to have physical struggle mistaken by some for apathy. As for "bad teammate", he's worn the C with Brandon and was also a captain at lower levels.
- bmeltzer

Agree 100%, there is enough of a track record to feel safe making Patrick the first pick. Although since you are the Flyers blogger, I assume this is reverse psychology and you are trying to trick us into drafting Patrick allowing Philly to take Hischier.

Agree 100%, there is enough of a track record to feel safe making Patrick the first pick. Although since you are the Flyers blogger, I assume this is reverse psychology and you are trying to trick us into drafting Patrick allowing Philly to take Hischier.
- smellmyfinger

Here's a good post I found on a site that was posted on reddit (on Nolan Patrick):

"ehhhhhhh. full disclosure i have my doctorate in physical therapy so i may be able to offer a little insight here. to put it bluntly, the injuries are worrisome. not so much the extent, but the locations. if you are ever gonna get injured, break a bone, easiest to heal and recover from, without question. the collarbone injury isn’t worrisome, risk for re-fracture, yes, but even so, its a 8week thing, bone heals, no problem. similar to what happened to mcdavid last year. no one was worried for lingering problems because fractured bones typically lead to less reoccurrences and even when they do occur, they are less complicated. If mcdavid strained a muscle or tendon or sprained a ligament, i think we could have seen more lingering complications.

The more worrisome, at least in my opinion are the sports hernia/groin injuries. any time the core is involved, problems typically linger, especially when it’s soft tissue. core (sports hernia) injuries totally zap athletes of power and explosion and are prone to just naggingly linger, often requiring months of rest and neuro re-ed to regain full function. your adductor muscle group or psoas muscles (groin/hipflexors) are both huge for skating explosion both side to side and forward and back respectively. those are red flags in my opinion as both muscle groups are big with trunk/core stability and power/explosion.

obviously, everyone is different and heals differently but, just in my experience, this is rather alarming for a first overall pick. I would be much less concerned if he broke his collar bone three times, and his leg another two. soft tissue injuries linger. especially ones that involve the core/trunk and proximal lower extremities. Your hip girdle is vital in hockey for speed, power, agility, stability, etc. 3/6 of his injuries (maybe 4/6) were of this type, and unfortunately they seem to be the most recent. I can just see these things continuing to pop up from time to time as the wear and tear from longer seasons against higher level competition comes about. also, a leg/knee injury is alarming for the same reasons as above. if it is ligamentous in nature, they’re is a much higher susceptibility of re injury once a ligament in sprained once. think of ankle sprains, once you get one, youre so much more likely to get another. same thing with knees and shoulders and any other ligaments in your body.

I just think if there was ever a need for a tie breaker; a player who may potentially be already susceptible to soft tissue injuries throughout his core and lower extremities is enough for me. it may not be fair; but its a risk thing imo. I just dont like seeing those types of things in 18 year olds when the hardest aspects of his career are yet to come. He may never be injured again, but, imo, there most definitely is a warranted skepticism to his ability to stay and maintain his health."

I more of the opinion to trade the pick for more assets and a slightly lower 1st round pick since there is no consensus #1 pick. But I guess that's why I work in the financial industry and am not a hockey GM.

Todd Cordell: More thoughts on Nico Hischier and Nolan Patrick
- Todd.Cordell

I'm not sure I agree on Ekblad...at all.

I more of the opinion to trade the pick for more assets and a slightly lower 1st round pick since there is no consensus #1 pick. But I guess that's why I work in the financial industry and am not a hockey GM.
- Crushers68

I'm still in favor of moving Schneider if it netted us a top pick or top prospects. I was dreaming about that potential deal to Dallas for the #3, but obviously that's out the window. But I'd consider THAT trade more than moving away from #1 all together.

I don't care about size, speed, strength; I want the guy who can put the damn puck in the net!

I'm not sure I agree on Ekblad...at all.
- jersey1414

He was spoonfed offensive zone starts more than any other defenseman on the Cats and they only posted *slightly* better numbers with him than without. Also, only had 11 5v5 points and averaged fewer points/60 than Shawn Thornton last season.

Personally speaking, I'd take the 70+ point forwards who can drive play.

He was spoonfed offensive zone starts more than any other defenseman on the Cats and they only posted *slightly* better numbers with him than without. Also, only had 11 5v5 points and averaged fewer points/60 than Shawn Thornton last season.

Personally speaking, I'd take the 70+ point forwards who can drive play.
- Todd.Cordell

Todd he's also only 21 and typically Defenseman take longer then forwards to develop i would wait and see how he's playing when he's 24-26 years old if he's still putting up similar numbers then I will agree

I was originally thinking we take Patrick no doubt but with what kind of player Zacha is and with Mcleod developing phenomenally we dont need another 6'2-'3 center two way forward. Nico is high skilled fast and is extremely dynamic. Tbh im 100% okay with either player. Nico fits our system better imo. Fast Attacking Supporting.